Problem Basing Using Sand

DomyHill · **Posted:** Fri Dec 06, 2013 5:33 pm

I have had a bit of a problem basing my miniatures using PVA glue and sand. When the glue dries sometimes bits of sand come off and a couple of times this has happened: http://sdrv.ms/1blRlgL
Any ideas?

RefluentMonk · **Joined:** Sun Nov 10, 2013 3:51 pm **Posts:** 120

Hey Dom , why dont you try some of the new GW texture paints , perhaps try stridland mud and then dry brush it with karak stone.

Dorthonion · **Posted:** Fri Dec 06, 2013 6:40 pm

Are you using a reasonable layer of PVA? Are you pressing the sand firmly against the PVA? I always put a lot more same on than will be required so I can press down on it without gluing myself to the base (stranger things have happened...)
I also rarely use sand over an entirs base - talus, cork fragments (great for larger 'rocks') and of course, flock and tufts.
The other thing is, not all PVA glues are of the same quality. I suggest a bit of experimentation.

Laevos · **Posted:** Fri Dec 06, 2013 7:17 pm

Interesting issue. I would also guess it has to do with the quality of the glue. I normally put a layer of sand across the entire base as well, but have never experienced the problems you showed. Not even now that some of the bases are several years old. At least if the entire sandlayer comes off you can use a different glue to put it back on the base.

JamesR · **Posted:** Fri Dec 06, 2013 7:30 pm

Also what you might try doing is gluing the sand on the base before you prime the model. The primer will help prevent it from falling off, you have to paint the sand this way of course, but it's an option

Hodush · **Posted:** Fri Dec 06, 2013 10:16 pm

Wow, that's interesting. I've never had that happen before. The closest it has happened was when I glued sand to a CD plastic disk (covers the CD's in a roll), but it only came off in one piece because i was prying it off.

I think you are either not using enough glue or that it is being watered down too much or you are putting something else on which is causing it not to bind to the base. Fill us in?

I use Selleys PVA (wood glue), haven't had an issue. I might use 2-3 dips of water to mix into the glue.

Bilbo · **Posted:** Sat Dec 07, 2013 4:40 am

The best results are to be had with super glue. Also you can pick up super glue for about 20 pence a tube from some where like pound stretcher that will be more than adequate.

DomyHill · **Posted:** Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:55 pm

I'm using PVA glue without watering it down at all. I spread it quite thick as well. I might try using super glue, problem with that is I always end up with my fingers stuck together.

Gandlaf the Grey · **Posted:** Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:29 pm

I haven't experienced this problem before but I think it's the type / brand of glue you are using. I use a wood glue that I water down by at least 50% and have never had a problem.
After I have glued the sand and let it dry, I coat with a thin colour paint of my choice. This creates the seal I want before painting properly.
Check the glue you using.
Another idea in the interim is to score in a criss cross pattern the base before you glue, it may provide the recess for the glue you are using to grip.

Leonardis · **Joined:** Wed Oct 05, 2011 4:06 pm **Posts:** 891

Don't spread it too thick! Just an even coat, you might need to experiment but I use enough to put a layer over the base, dip it in the sand and leave to dry, I then spray the model with primer, then when I paint the base I dry brush several layers.

Good luck!

DomyHill · **Posted:** Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:46 pm

I've tried scoring the bases before, it helped when I was making movement trays with smooth plasticard but GW bases are already rough so it didn't really help. I think you're right about the glue though, it was only cheap and it's not really a particularly thick consistency so it might be that it's already been watered down. To B&Q!

Creaky · **Joined:** Thu Nov 07, 2013 9:26 pm **Posts:** 424

That's... new.

I recently bought GW brand glue (I normally use the stuff from art shops thats much cheaper, but i was in the store at the time...) and have encountered a problem where clumps of sand would come unstuck in patches, leaving areas of base exposed - but this is on another level.

Hodush · **Posted:** Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:21 pm

I would definitely recommend changing the glue first before going to super glue. If its not working for this, you wouldn't be able to use it for much else so it's not worth having. You will never be able to get super glue as cheap/in as large amounts as PVA, and PVA should do the job fine.

Dagorlad · **Posted:** Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:47 pm

PVA is designed to stick to porous material - wood, paper, cloth, etc. It forms a very weak bond with plastic, glass and metal and can be easily peeled off once it's set. I never use if for plastic bases, because of exactly the issue you describe. Super glue or epoxy resins are best. Plastic cement is not a good idea as it will dissolve the base slightly (it's a solvent).

I actually use polyfilla as my basing material and it sticks to plastic and metal extremely well.

JamesR · **Posted:** Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:13 pm

Just to throw it out there "wood glue" also works quite well lol. It's very strong and pretty easy to move about as needed before it dries

Hashut's Blessing · **Joined:** Fri Jan 15, 2010 8:41 pm **Posts:** 1279

The best thing to do is to use the PVA, then apply the sand, let dry over night, tap the excess off and then undercoat your model. The spray acts as a sealant and stops it flaking off etc.

Problem Basing Using Sand

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