rumtap wrote:
I'll say Isengard troll, just to be annoying.
That was pretty good! Ive only once face and Isengard Troll, but never used one
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| Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll http://gbain.powweb.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=27767 |
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| Author: | GWvsJohn [ Tue Feb 04, 2014 3:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
Taking their respective army lists out of consideration, point for point, what do you guys is better, a Cave Troll or a Mordor Troll? The F7 of a Mordor Troll is a big advantage against heroes, forcing them to Heroic Strike. But the Cave Troll is much cheaper. You can get 2-3 orcs for the difference. Looking at army lists for a second, it seems to me that if you have some way to neutralize heroes (cough, Nazgul, cough) the Cave Troll seems better. |
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| Author: | the big goblin [ Tue Feb 04, 2014 4:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
I think a mordor is better. |
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| Author: | Goldman25 [ Tue Feb 04, 2014 4:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
Depends who you're up against. Against Rohan, you might as well get the Cave troll and the extra troops, but against Minas Tirith/Elves/Dwarves, you'll need the Mordor troll's better statline (cracking through high Defense, higher Fight value). |
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| Author: | Beowulf03809 [ Tue Feb 04, 2014 5:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
They complement such different forces and are designed and pointed appropriately. Cave Trolls are relatively cheap and can still beef up a horde army without impacting the ability to "horde". If you're not heavy with Heroes or specialists you can have 2-3 Cave Trolls in a very large Moria force. Mordor Trolls are tough spear-heads that you can include (one or two) to help provide some focused punch to an already tougher army. Obviously you can mix and match things different, but the army they typically play in and the design considerations behind that army have as much of a factor as their own stat lines and points. |
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| Author: | whafrog [ Tue Feb 04, 2014 8:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
GWvsJohn wrote: Looking at army lists for a second, it seems to me that if you have some way to neutralize heroes (cough, Nazgul, cough) the Cave Troll seems better. ...it seems to me that if you have some way to neutralize heroes (cough, bats, cough)... |
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| Author: | GWvsJohn [ Tue Feb 04, 2014 9:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
whafrog wrote: GWvsJohn wrote: Looking at army lists for a second, it seems to me that if you have some way to neutralize heroes (cough, Nazgul, cough) the Cave Troll seems better. ...it seems to me that if you have some way to neutralize heroes (cough, bats, cough)... Too true, but alas, I prefer orcs to goblins. I was mainly comparing the two in terms of the Angmar v. Mordor lists. |
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| Author: | JamesR [ Tue Feb 04, 2014 9:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
This takes computer bug to a whole new level with all you guys coughing. Lol I prefer the Cave Troll myself, but Moria is a regular force that I field. The 20 points you save are well worth it to me as the +1 F, S, D are all useful but don't typically impact games too much in my experience. I understand the +1 fight does help against the occasional fight 6; elves but so does the 5 goblins you can add with the cave troll |
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| Author: | rumtap [ Tue Feb 04, 2014 10:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
I'll say Isengard troll, just to be annoying. |
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| Author: | JamesR [ Tue Feb 04, 2014 10:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
rumtap wrote: I'll say Isengard troll, just to be annoying. That was pretty good! Ive only once face and Isengard Troll, but never used one |
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| Author: | Coenus Scaldingus [ Tue Feb 04, 2014 11:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
Main selling point on the Cave Troll is not just the lower cost (which does combine nicely with an army with often more points to spend on extras, whereas Mordor will look to buy more elite troops and heroes), but the smaller base size as well. When fighting in some sort of line, the Cave Troll will face 2 enemy models, while the Mordor Troll will be up against 3 or 4. In many situations, that base is a massive difference. The Mordor Troll's F7 is very useful against especially Elves or Dwarven heroes however, and the higher Defence is of great value against most heroes and some troops. That being said, I rarely use a Mordor Troll, while I always like including a Cave Troll or two in my Moria lists. |
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| Author: | Hodush [ Wed Feb 05, 2014 12:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
Point for point, the cave troll is better (just add 5 points per stat). I can't recall if the courage is the same or not, but I wouldn't pay 5 pts for 1 courage anyway. I think overall the Mordor troll is better against an unknown army - F7 is the seller. But the cheap cost of the cave troll is a strong point. |
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| Author: | JamesR [ Wed Feb 05, 2014 12:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
Cave Troll is the same courage |
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| Author: | Highlordell [ Fri Feb 21, 2014 3:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
Hodush wrote: I think overall the Mordor troll is better against an unknown army - F7 is the seller. But the cheap cost of the cave troll is a strong point. This is one of the most important points I think. Although now not as important due to heroic strike, there are way more models as F6 than7 (only Elves, Azog (?) Bolg (?) and Elendil from what I recall, so you're basically just aiming for sixes. Also D7 over D6 is massive with the amount of S4 troops, and most heroes in general needing to roll sixes, You're suddenly 50% more survivable. The Mordor troll also has cheiftain variants which are useful the times you dont roll high enough, and a drummer. |
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| Author: | VandalCabbage [ Fri Feb 21, 2014 4:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
Heroic strike changed all that. I'd say the cave troll since defence will rarely make much of a difference. |
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| Author: | Bronf [ Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
i'm just gonna throw my 2 cents in. im kinda disappointed with isenguard trolls. i mainly take them out quickly before they can do any damage and they end up being a waste of points for my opponent's. my quickest take down was turn 2 first turn of combat 4 goblins just killed him. my slowest 5 turns and it didn't make much of a dint of my force. i take cave trolls just so if it does die the points that were lost wouldn't be much of a impact. |
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| Author: | Lord Hurin [ Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
rumtap wrote: I'll say Isengard troll, just to be annoying. BOOO!!! HISS!!!! Heheh, I was one of the biggest detractors of the Isengard Troll when it came out. Along with being unthematic, it just doesn't add a whole lot to and Isengard force that 10 more Uruk-hai wouldn't. As for this question, I like 'em both. They make great centrepieces to an army. |
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| Author: | rumtap [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 1:40 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
Lord Hurin wrote: rumtap wrote: I'll say Isengard troll, just to be annoying. BOOO!!! HISS!!!! Heheh, I was one of the biggest detractors of the Isengard Troll when it came out. Along with being unthematic, it just doesn't add a whole lot to and Isengard force that 10 more Uruk-hai wouldn't. As for this question, I like 'em both. They make great centrepieces to an army. LOL. I take them for that reason. "What but they wern't in the movie". Plus i like the look of the giant shield. But in this debate i'm leaning towards cave troll. |
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| Author: | rumtap [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 1:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cave Troll vs. Mordor Troll |
Bronf wrote: i'm just gonna throw my 2 cents in. im kinda disappointed with isenguard trolls. i mainly take them out quickly before they can do any damage and they end up being a waste of points for my opponent's. my quickest take down was turn 2 first turn of combat 4 goblins just killed him. my slowest 5 turns and it didn't make much of a dint of my force. i take cave trolls just so if it does die the points that were lost wouldn't be much of a impact. I find that is the case with all the regular trolls. They have the potential to do a lot of damage but they can go down pretty quickly without might and fate to back them up. |
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