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Bow limits for certain army lists?
http://gbain.powweb.com/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=25052		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  goblin_king [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:46 am ]
Post subject:  Bow limits for certain army lists?
Hi guys,
I'm having a brain fart moment.... Where are the rules for what specific bow limits affect certain forces? Such as Rohan or Harad, which I seem to recall had different limits?

Cheers!
Author:  SouthernDunedain [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bow limits for certain army lists?
In the various sourcebooks and FAQs. Normally says at the beginning of each new army section.
Author:  whafrog [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bow limits for certain army lists?
I think it's okay to share this, it's pretty common knowledge and discussed a lot. Harad is 50% bows, but I think you are limited to Haradrim warriors and Watchers of Karna. If you include other warrior types you're back to 33%. RoR don't count towards the bow limit so RoR can always shoot.
Author:  Falkrik [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bow limits for certain army lists?
whafrog wrote:
I think it's okay to share this, it's pretty common knowledge and discussed a lot. Harad is 50% bows, but I think you are limited to Haradrim warriors and Watchers of Karna. If you include other warrior types you're back to 33%. RoR don't count towards the bow limit so RoR can always shoot.

If your army consisted of strictly RoR, could they all shoot every turn? or could only a certain amount of them shoot?
Author:  Beowulf03809 [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 3:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bow limits for certain army lists?
You can shoot all RoR every turn. The challenge you will have is that the new rules impose a -1 shoot penalty if you move at all and shoot. So you will probably develop a technique similar to modern cover fire. About half of your RoR stay still and fire heavily. The rest advance to the next position and fire as best as they can with the -1 (you may get lucky). Next turn they stay still and shoot while the half that did not move the previous turn advances this turn.

You can maximize this technique in several ways. For example, dividing into thirds instead of half will slow your overall movement but allow 2/3 of your force to shoot full each turn. Or doing halves but only moving Group A 1/2 move the first turn, so Group B can leapfrog with a full move on the next turn. Then Group A and B continue to full-move and leapfrog each other every other. You can also do either of these but move in different directions from each other allowing you to both shoot full with half of your force (and shoot -1 with the other half) each turn while hopefully splitting up your opponent's force.

With the Harad force, did they include Serpent Raiders in that as well?
Author:  cereal_theif [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 6:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bow limits for certain army lists?
The 50% bow harad list is if it includes warriors
- abra
- serp
- harad
- watchers
add any other harad warriors (such as mahud or corsairs) and it goes back to 33%
Author:  GothmogtheWerewolf [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 7:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bow limits for certain army lists?
cereal_theif wrote:
The 50% bow harad list is if it includes warriors
- abra
- serp
- harad
- watchers
add any other harad warriors (such as mahud or corsairs) and it goes back to 33%

Just to make this clearer, he means Haradrim Warriors, Haradrim Raiders, Serpent Guards, Serpent Warrirs, Abrakhan Guards, and Watchers of Karna.

Also, I don't think it was mentioned but Rivindell Knights have a 100% bow limit, Hunter Orcs have a 50& bow limit, and Arnor have 100% as long as they take 1 RotN/Dunedain for every 4 RoA.
Author:  Beowulf03809 [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 7:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bow limits for certain army lists?
cereal_theif wrote:
The 50% bow harad list is if it includes warriors
- abra
- serp
- harad
- watchers
add any other harad warriors (such as mahud or corsairs) and it goes back to 33%


Gotcah. Those others aren't actual Harad so I wasn't considering them and completely understand.
Author:  Dr Grant [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 8:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bow limits for certain army lists?
I know there was a thread discussing this a while back but was there ever a consensus/ruling reached about if ROR (or any other troop type that changes/ignores bow limit) still count towards the bow limit in terms of number of warriors?

Essentially, which of the following is correct:

If I have 18 riders of Rohan and 9 Warriors of Rohan, 3 of the Warriors of Rohan be armed with bows - 33% of 9 - The ROR 'don't count' towards the bow limit.

Or

If I have 18 riders of Rohan and 9 Warriors of Rohan, 9 of the Warriors of Rohan be armed with bows - 33% of 27 - The ROR 'ignore' the bow limit

Makes a big difference...
Author:  LordElrond [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 8:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bow limits for certain army lists?
I'm pretty sure it's the first one...
Author:  Dr Grant [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 8:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bow limits for certain army lists?
That's what I think. It says that they don't count towards your bow limit. I read this as those models don't count towards working out what your bow limit is. It's a little on the ambiguous side though.
Author:  Curufinwë [ Mon Jan 28, 2013 10:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bow limits for certain army lists?
Yeah I believe its this one:

Dr Grant wrote:
If I have 18 riders of Rohan and 9 Warriors of Rohan, 3 of the Warriors of Rohan be armed with bows - 33% of 9 - The ROR 'don't count' towards the bow limit.


The way I was interpreting the rule was that RoR are considered a second faction for determining your bow limit.
Author:  whafrog [ Tue Jan 29, 2013 12:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bow limits for certain army lists?
I'd lean that way as well, otherwise it seems like abuse of an already good thing.
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